Quote: ThirstyMan wrote in post #15 I think it's wise to reflect and pray on all of the above. Does anyone think they have the one answer that can be applied to all?
I read one mother's response to Liza Long's letter. She assured all that no child of hers would EVER get away with calling her a bitch. That child would first have to deal with her AND THEN the father. Pretty simple hey? Evidently it worked for her everytime so she had the root cause identified in her mind.
But perhaps she never had one of these children. What if punishment and then more punishment only fueled the problem?
Maybe we should begin looking hard and long at the problem and reflect on the reality of our hopeless situation.
Zitat Palinista I saw the woman who wrote this blog being interviewed on television. She looked sad and tired.
When asked why she wrote it, she said she wrote it primarily for herself. She didn't know that the whole world would read it.
Her son knew she wrote it. Her son thought it was a good idea. He thought it might help another mother or son.
None of us can truly understand it unless we walk in another's shoes and live that life.
Zitat ThirstyMan Your last line rings so true. I cannot imagine living in a family situation where we'd have a pre-arranged safety drill with the other siblings to go lock yourself in the car should "Michael" get violent.
And the real Mrs Lanza died of multiple gunshot wounds to the head. She was the first victim. And Adam Lanza was the last.
Now can anyone tell us that you understand the nature of these crimes and are able to offer the solution?
My gut feeling is we are supposed to learn that we are in a hopeless situation. That has to be the first step in moving toward any cure. I'm open to other ideas.
Quote: ThirstyMan wrote in post #13Wouldn't it be nice if one thing would emerge as the cause of these tragedies?
If someone would only stand up and shout "I have the key!" [and be right]
The diagnosis is obviously so elusive but it's just what we need.
In what has become typical fashion for our culture, we're deeply divided.
Deeply divided and so often we're pretty shallow in our diagnoses. The truth is we have no idea what's causing our affliction. We see the fruit of our condition and scramble to find THE cause.
Mental illness, automatic weapons, video games, violent movies, violent cartoons/entertainment, absentee parenting, abusive parenting, bullying, psych drugs, psych itself, genetics, God being evicted, end times. a combination of some or all of the above?
I think it's wise to reflect and pray on all of the above. Does anyone think they have the one answer that can be applied to all?
I read one mother's response to Liza Long's letter. She assured all that no child of hers would EVER get away with calling her a bitch. That child would first have to deal with her AND THEN the father. Pretty simple hey? Evidently it worked for her everytime so she had the root cause identified in her mind.
But perhaps she never had one of these children. What if punishment and then more punishment only fueled the problem?
Maybe we should begin looking hard and long at the problem and reflect on the reality of our hopeless situation.
Great post, TM, many good points!
I get my dose of what "the world" is talking about from the 1/2 news breaks on talk radio when it is on, the occasional 10-15 minute scan of FNC when I am in a room with a TV, and from articles online. So I can't really comment on just how bad it all is, but from these doses it seems pretty damn bad. The one person that I would be interested in hearing from in the "media" (Glenn Beck) appears to be on vacation already as there are fill-ins each day for the BlazeTV show and radio show.
The thing that I have noticed from all of this is what you pointed out above, there seems to be this mass frenzy to "figure it out!" Again from the small doses that I've seen/heard, it seems wholly obsessive. And of course, everyone with an agenda is out in full force, grinding it out. And at this point I have so little faith and trust in the "media" that I have no expectation that the real truth about any of these events (along with virtually all other events of significance) will ever be available.
I'm sure that there are some folks wading through all of this that have pure intentions and fully believe that their efforts (in whatever direction they are focused) are intended to bring about "good," but I suspect that those individuals are few and far between in the swelling crowd. And with regard to your last sentence, I agree that the reality of this current (physical) world is indeed hopeless, but as always for believers we know what lies ahead. In times like these however, I struggle mightily to keep my "eyes on the prize" as I feel surrounded by despair in this world.
One thing to keep in mind is that until recently technology wasn't available to see the very real brain disorder of a severely mentally ill person in an active psychotic state. If you've never been around one of these young people during an active rage you really don't grasp how desperate these parents are.
It isn't just a spiritual problem. It isn't just a mental problem. It is an ignored problem. It is a problem that is underfunded and wrongly dealt with publicly. These sick individuals have to pretty much commit a crime before they can get any sort of longterm treatment. It should not be that way.
Quote: steph wrote in post #18One thing to keep in mind is that until recently technology wasn't available to see the very real brain disorder of a severely mentally ill person in an active psychotic state. If you've never been around one of these young people during an active rage you really don't grasp how desperate these parents are.
It isn't just a spiritual problem. It isn't just a mental problem. It is an ignored problem. It is a problem that is underfunded and wrongly dealt with publicly. These sick individuals have to pretty much commit a crime before they can get any sort of longterm treatment. It should not be that way.
This is becoming more clear, isn't it?
When the detective wants to solve the crime [Frank] he gets into the head of the perp and tries to think like he thinks.
When you get into the head of Adam Lanza what do you see? The man puts several bullets into the head of his mother, kills 28 at school and then kills himself.
What does that say about the perp? What was his goal? In what reality does such behavior make any sense? I have always said you can't "understand" evil. It comes and it leaves its mark. Beyond pure evil is there any aspect of this carnage that can be understood? I honestly think the answer may be "no". So many are trying to attach their causal banner to the event to gain yardage but this one defies logic doesn't it?
Mental illness is real. Some people have homicidal tendencies from their mental illness. The bleeding hearts mean well but their policies make matters worse. You can get help for a minor mentally ill child but you can't force it on a just legal mentally ill young adult who is incapacitated. Not every mentally ill person needs long term institutionalization. They do well with community based treatment. But the young adults like Adam Lanza, Jared Loughner and James Holmes are simply insane.
Quote: steph wrote in post #20Mental illness is real. Some people have homicidal tendencies from their mental illness. The bleeding hearts mean well but their policies make matters worse. You can get help for a minor mentally ill child but you can't force it on a just legal mentally ill young adult who is incapacitated. Not every mentally ill person needs long term institutionalization. They do well with community based treatment. But the young adults like Adam Lanza, Jared Loughner and James Holmes are simply insane.
Andrea Yates comes to mind, too. That woman was screaming out for help and her stupid husband was too wrapped up in his work and in his own view of how she should behave as a mother to seek outside help. He knew she was falling apart and he ignored every single warning sign. She shouldn't have been left alone with her children. When she had the opportunity, she killed them.
I don't think she killed them because she was evil.
I think she killed them because her brain was severely ill.
If her husband had paid attention and gotten her help when she obviously needed it, his children might be alive, today.
Maybe that help should have been drastic. Maybe she needed extensive psychiatric care. Maybe he should have divorced her because she wasn't the perfect homeschool mother that could take care of four little kids and bake chocolate chip cookies like he envisioned she should have. Maybe he should have ditched the wife and got a new one that could have lived under such dictates.
He's one of the dumbest people on the planet, his children are dead and she's screwed up for life. I don't care if she's in prison or out, in treatment or not. She'll never fully recover from what happened.
I blame him as much as I blame her for the death of their children. She killed them, but he did nothing to protect them.
Orthodoxy SUCKS.
"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with senses, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use and by some other means to give us knowledge which we can attain by them."- Galileo Galilei
Quote: steph wrote in post #20Mental illness is real. Some people have homicidal tendencies from their mental illness. The bleeding hearts mean well but their policies make matters worse. You can get help for a minor mentally ill child but you can't force it on a just legal mentally ill young adult who is incapacitated. Not every mentally ill person needs long term institutionalization. They do well with community based treatment. But the young adults like Adam Lanza, Jared Loughner and James Holmes are simply insane.
Andrea Yates comes to mind, too. That woman was screaming out for help and her stupid husband was too wrapped up in his work and in his own view of how she should behave as a mother to seek outside help. He knew she was falling apart and he ignored every single warning sign. She shouldn't have been left alone with her children. When she had the opportunity, she killed them.
I don't think she killed them because she was evil.
I think she killed them because her brain was severely ill.
If her husband had paid attention and gotten her help when she obviously needed it, his children might be alive, today.
Good discussion, thanks.
The line between evil and ill for these people is a difficult for us to deduce. If one looks at the behaviors? they are clearly evil. If one looks at the situation? they are severely ill.
Perhaps they are so severely ill that they are both; ill and evil.
RIGHT'S RIGHT 
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Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:00 am
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